Controversy: The FBI Wants To Log Everything You Do Online

[shigzeo]

It has been a long time coming, but it is obvious that internet users rights are getting smaller all the time. Now, the FBI would like to log all information including surfing habits for up to 2 years. Naturally, it would contravene the Wire Tap Act as well as a number of treaties. Nothing has been passed, but this is something everyone should take a moment to ponder.

In many ways, the internet has brought together an international community. TMA forums along is comprised of members from dozens of countries. How would you feel if the FBI suddenly were given free reign, and especially if that reign went out of the USA to our countries?

In case this gets responses, let's keep this civil. The question has nothing to do with a country or politics, but policing agencies stalking the internet.

More at DisInfo (http://www.disinfo.com/2010/02/the-fbi-wants-to-log-everything-you-do-online/)

[NineSwords]

Aren't they already doing this? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echelon_%28signals_intelligence%29)

[Ron]

I don't worry too much simply because they won't find any illegal activity from me. (as far as I know! :eek: ). If they want to know that I visit a forum, check out app websites, read about auto racing, etc. that is fine by me. If this were to happen my hope is that it help catch a "bad guy" as it is my tax dollars at work, so to speek. Sorry if I sound like I don't care but I have more concerns in my life that have immediate effect on the well being of my kids and me.

[SteveNaka]

O SNAP! HIDE!!!

Seriously tho...I agree with Ron. Unless you're doing something online that's gonna get you into trouble, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.If it's a "privacy" issue, then it's the fault of whoever posted their private "whatever" online. Yes the internet is safe for a lot of things...but it is far from secure...hell, having the fbi online spying might actually make it better..lol

[juubee]

More good than harm. For all the horrible things certain people do and we do have really messed up people in this world.

[shigzeo]

Not sure I can agree. It is basically assuming people will break laws. It can also be used out of context. Information is information only. When used by people with foul intent, it can go wrong. I don't feel good about this ... in England it has gotten bad, though somewhat tamed recently. Not internet, but other privacy concerns where users really are put down. Obviously, a lot needs to change in online and offline world, but I think users should really have input to decide rather than some corporation being granted carte blanche.

[SteveNaka]

Well, at least they are saying they are doing it. You'd prob lose count trying to track the amount of companies/people/evil doers that are and have been doing this for years without your knowing. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if there's a whole lot of "me" sittin' on a server somewhere. I'm not stupid as far what I do online, but I also don't put a lot of effort into hiding/covering tracks. As much as I might not like the idea of someone looking over my shoulder at what I do online it's happening more and more...and as passive as it is to say...it's just the kind of world we are growing into.

[mrholder]

If you have wireless internet (wifi) set up in your house/apartment, SECURE IT with a password. All it takes is someone in a van, riding around the neighborhood looking for free wifi, to get you into serious trouble with the FBI. If they find your open wifi, they can do all kinds of illegal things, and it will appear to the FBI that YOU did it. I read about this and just wanted to put out a friendly reminder/warning.

[tractorqueen]

We had a whole bunch of cars parked in the park next to my house using our wifi when we first got it til my bro remember to secure it with password. I think somehow, someone also found a way to hack into our dial up years ago, we get bills with usage at odd hours when no one's home. God knows what those people were up to, hopefully it wasn't anything illegal!

Personally, I don't think anyone would want to read my nonsense online, unless they are willing to read through 40 over thousand tweets to (and with) some celebrities, my girly chats with my girls all over the world and what I ate!

But seriously, how much (surveillance) is too much? Takes paranoia to a whole new level! *is anyone on surveillance reading this? :D *

[SteveNaka]

even when/if they find out it was someone else, you can still be held liable to a degree. Ignorance is never a viable defense. It should also be noted that if you (anyone, not specifically anybody here) do anything questionable on free or public wifi, there is always a possibility that it can be traced back to you.

Bottom line is, protect your own stuff and always remember The Golden Rule (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Golden_Rule_%28ethics%29)

[Thunderclaw]

Anyone here read "Digital Fortress" by Dan Brown? It totally applies here.

I don't care too much, but I still like my privacy.
I wouldn't throw a fit if they did start.

[Nullroar]

I don't worry too much simply because they won't find any illegal activity from me.

A lot of people believe this. Unfortunately, this doesn't address methodology. What if your habits were suddenly ruled illegal? The "Green Police" Audi commercial wasn't too far off the mark. What if the television you are buying on ebay is illegal? (http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/03/california-tv/). What if you post a comment about your daughter's lemonade stand, and the cops show up? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/06/police-shut-down-7-year-o_n_253017.html).

What if Citizen's United vs. the FEC went the other way, and you were found distributing corporate propaganda (like sending a funny anti-politician Youtube video to your friends)?

The fact is, the only reason government does not completely regulate the people is because it still lacks the proper tools. Cede your privacy and you WILL never get it back.
Never in history has any government or authoritarian power had the potential to accumulate so much information on people.

RFID's and other tracking devices exist in newly issued passports. They are being legislated into state ID cards such as driver's licenses.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GursOom9dNA
"Medical device information...medical records...and personal information."

Imagine a government that has this kind of access. People in Mexico are implanting their children with these chips, to track their location so they are not kidnapped.
In the ultimate act of irony, the desperation of people for "safety" may well be our ultimate surrender of all actual defense.

I know it's kind of rambling, but this is true.
Government exists to serve us. Government should always be scared of the watchful eye of the people, not the other way around.

[Ron]

@Nullroar- What can I say? I simply do not feel these possibilities/situations will effect me or my children. Even if I were to post something, for example, that was illegal, at most it may put me on someones watch list. After being "watched" it will be found that I am an overall good person not worth going after ("there are bigger fish to fry"). Maybe I have more faith in our Constitution, Bill of Rights, etc. Maybe I am happily ignorant...

Hey Louis, please don't boot me out of the forum. This post ends my discussion of politics (in case you consider this politics)...:)

[Nullroar]

Ron, you seem to think that it won't effect you because it will be put on a watch list. But as government becomes increasingly automated and able to process more data, the bureaucracy that would otherwise leave millions of "people of interest" happily safe behind mountains of paperwork is removed. What is keeping these people of interest safe is not that the system is good, or that the system is too wise, but that the system is too inefficient. When this changes - which it will, as our international databases become more comrpehensive, as RFID chips slowly become commonplace and then mandatory, as automated surveillance and instantaneous data on anyone becomes a reality- there really will be no "last line of defense." Once a system is in place that could be used to root out communications of any sort of dissent, any sort of organizing, any sort of anything, what is there to stop government from going after you? It would be given the weapons it needs to silence not only those who speak out publicly, but privately.

We should never rationalize things on a basis of "if we do right, we have nothing to worry about," when we no longer control what the government decrees is right.
Instead, ask yourself: SHOULD the government have this access? Forget if what you are doing conforms or not to the law, just ask if the government should have this sort of power over people in the first place.
Just remember- Freedoms taken at the point of a sword can be regained the same way, but freedoms willingly ceded are lost forever.